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First Race Weekend! Setup Issues?
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NASA Rocky Mountain Region

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TOPIC: First Race Weekend! Setup Issues?

First Race Weekend! Setup Issues? 16 years, 7 months ago #749

  • Skimr2
  • OFFLINE
  • Drivers Ed
  • Posts: 16
Yo fellow 944 pilots.... I just completed my first race weekend with my spec car, Saturday and Sunday at Miller and now have a competition license. The weekend was great, and the races were a blast! Especially the Saturday event. Both days were on the West track at Miller Motorsports Park. The track is 2.2 miles or so with two good straightaways and and some good high speed turns!
I qualified 11th out of 17 and finished 7th. The group is a local catch all small bore series and there were a bunch of miatas, a couple of hondas, an old 356, an old Z. I was involved in several good battles, and the adrenaline rush was great. I know there are more race prepped 944's here, so I am not sure why they aren't coming out for the MPRA (Miller Park Racing Association) events.
I ran my fastest lap times Sunday, but didn't finish as well. My fasted lap was a 1:50.292. The fasted Miatas were running mid 1:48.
So it was a blast, but there is more speed available to me if I can get the handling issues on my car figured out.

Since I recieved the car, it has pushed pretty significantly, to the point where the front tires get greasy and stop gripping. In the race Saturday and Sunday I was caught in the latter half of the race by cars that should have been slower than I was, due to my gradual reduction of front traction.

Here is how my car was setup by the end of the weekend,

Front Sway bar: 28mm Weltmeister adj, full soft
Rear Sway bar: 18mm (Turbo bar?)
Koni Yellow Front: Full soft
Rear: Full stiff (Adjusted Sunday morning to combat push, helped, didn't solve)
Springs Front: 350lbs (changed from 400lbs before weekend to combat push. Helped, still pushes)
Torsion Bars: 30 mm (suspected, info conveyed by prev owner, not verified)
Camber Front: -2 degrees (set and checked using pyrometer and camber gauge)
Camber Rear: Unknown, noticeably negative, wearing the inside of the tire more than the outside)
Tire Pressures Hot:
Front: 33psi
Rear: 36psi
Tires: Toyo R888

The car was setup in AZ with the droopy rear end. See the attached pictures to see what I mean. Also check out the cool vinyl Sid hooked me up with!
Basically the car never reached what I would call neutral, it pushed pretty consistent, although to a lesser degree by the end of the weekend, and my lap times reflected increasing speeds. I think I may need to go to a matching sway bar in the rear to balance it out and move the shocks on all corners more towards the middle setting. Also, I am going to reindex the torsion bars so the ass end gets up off the ground a little bit.
I would love to hear discussion on car setup and hear any ideas that you may have. Please, discuss.

Re:First Race Weekend! Setup Issues? 16 years, 7 months ago #750

First off it looks GREAT ! And I'm glad you had a good time !

Second what would it take to get you to drive over the hills and come play with us at Pueblo in May ? We will have OVER 20 cars ! and not just any small bore but 20 944-SPEC race cars ...

The reason I say bring it over is that we can set that puppy up and check it out . You can also try out other peoples cars ... at the track and really help you out. So come play with us ASAP. Yes we will all be coming to you in June but that is going to be a tight weekend time wise.

Ok now to help...

the 30mm rear bars are like 320lb spring rate in the rear. So I have run 300 lb springs in the front to make the car Oversteer. The faster cars run 350 or 400 # springs in the front. So I would say stick to the 350# springs in the front and when you can, get a Weltmiester rear sway bar from Dart. I LOVE THAT SWAY BAR !

That welt front bar is huge and stiff even on full soft.

Maybe the front air pressure is too low ... was the wear touching the triangles ?
Maybe more front camber...

Full Track racing at Miller is going to be Awesome !

Re:First Race Weekend! Setup Issues? 16 years, 7 months ago #751

  • Skimr2
  • OFFLINE
  • Drivers Ed
  • Posts: 16
That is sort of what I was thinking. I think I need to make he jump to the Welt Rear bar. I am still going to raise the rear end a tad however.

Re:First Race Weekend! Setup Issues? 16 years, 7 months ago #753

The droopy rear end is why you have understeer.

If you use a 350lbs front and 30 mm rear you need the car level front to rear. You can only run a lower rear if you use 250lbs fronts.

I run 350 front/30 rear with level front to rear ride height.
I use welt sways front and rear and have -3.5 camber front and -2.5 camber rear,0 front toe and 1/16 toe in rear. It is fairly well balanaced. I also have an open diff.

The other thing. 33 hot is WAY too low for the R888's.

You need to see 41 hot to keep the tire from rolling over on the sidewalls as this costs grip and will damage the tire. This weekend one of our top drivers ran on R888's and ran close to 41 hot for best results. He used to run 36 hot with RA-1's.
Joe Paluch
944 Spec #94 Gina Marie Paper Designs
Arizona Regional 944 Spec Director, National Rules Coordinator
2006 Az Champion - 944 Spec Racer Since 2002
Last Edit: 16 years, 7 months ago by joepaluch.

Re:First Race Weekend! Setup Issues? 16 years, 7 months ago #758

  • Skimr2
  • OFFLINE
  • Drivers Ed
  • Posts: 16
Thanks Joe, I certainly will be reindexing the torsion bars when I get a chance. A number of people I spoke with at the track suggested raising the rear as well. As for the tire pressure, my lap times dropped as I lowered the tire pressure in the fronts. I was at 36 hot in the back, and the front to start. I will go higher next time out. I think I will also order a weltmeister rear sway bar.
Thanks for the tips!

Re:First Race Weekend! Setup Issues? 16 years, 7 months ago #761

944's are inherently well balanced - you'll be amazed when you get the setup dialed in. I agree with above. The lack of rear bar, and the low rear ride height are big issues, but both fixable. If you don't get a chance to re-index the rear bar before the next race, you can get some height through adjusting the rear eccentric on the trailing arms/blades.
Eric Kuhns

National Director Emeritus

2007, & 2008 National Champion
2011, 2012 2nd
Last Edit: 16 years, 7 months ago by Sterling Doc.
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